Untitled Document

Pradyumna: "The intelligent, who have understood the Supreme Lord in association with pure devotees and have become freed..."
Prabhupada: "In association with pure devotees." So if you are karmis, then where is the..., What is the value of this association? Sat-sanga. Sat-sanga means assembly, discussion. Bodhayantah parasparam, tusyanti ca ramanti ca. If you are not interested in association, discussion, then you are finished. So... karmis, they are fools and rascals. When you have got this center, it is not that you should be engaged from morning till you go to bed for sense gratification. That is not life. That is karmi's life. You have no time for sat-sanga, for association. You cannot make any progress by this sort of karmi's life. We have to work for organization, but not that whole day and night engaged and no sat-sanga. That is a misguided policy, and it will spoil the whole structure. In Los Angeles, they regularly assemble during arati and class. If this regulative principle is lost, then you are karmis. They must come back by six o'clock, suspending all other duties, and assemble by seven o'clock. Joint mess program is not good. "You bring some money, you bring some money and spend us jointly for eating, sleeping." That is called joint mess. You know the joint mess? This word? What is that, meaning?
Brahmananda: Well, it means... I thought it had something to do with civil servants, where they all live in a dormitory and eat in a large hall.
Prabhupada: Yes, yes.
Brahmananda: And they all contribute...
Prabhupada: Yes.
Brahmananda: ...part of their salary.
Prabhupada: So if you make that association, that will not help you. Joint mess, dormitory. Or joint family. Just like in India. There are five brothers. They're earning. Father and mother is the leader. They're handing over the money, and the father, mother managing. That is Indian system, a joint family. So joint family or joint mess, the same thing. So if you make like that, a center, then it is no good. You must get spiritual strength. Karmi strength will not help you. What they are doing in Babar(?) Road, these girls?
Guru dasa: They're preparing some srngara for Deity.
Prabhupada: Why not here? Why go to Babar Road, spend twenty rupees?
Guru dasa: According to them, that sometimes they have to go in the center of town.
Prabhupada: Nobody has intelligence. It will not, it will not stay. It will be spoiled. Joint mess organization. In Los Angeles, they're also doing business. They're going to sell books. But regulative principle is observed. Huge expenditure they have got. No center is so improved as Los Angeles. We have purchased six houses. And I wanted immediately two lakhs, immediately sent. You cannot pay. You simply want to take. In India, nobody can pay. If I want two lakhs, nobody can pay. But all this money have been taken from U.S.A. I asked Bali Mardana, I asked Karandhara. They paid me for this Bombay affair, sixteen, eighteen lakhs. (break) ...and breathing also does not stop. It goes very slow. Therefore he cannot be immortal. And Bhagavad-gita proposes, that is wonderful thing, if you can stop death. And whole spiritual life means how to stop death. That is Bhagavata's instruction, "Don't accept guru, don't accept father, don't accept, or don't be father, don't be mother, don't be, if you cannot stop death." Either you don't accept, or don't become. Just like they want guru. So don't accept a guru who cannot stop your death. And from guru's side, it is advised, "Don't become guru if you cannot stop the death of your disciple." This is Bhagavatam's statement. So our Krsna consciousness movement is to stop death, live eternally with Krsna, go back to home, back to Godhead. This is our movement. So our guru gives us this opportunity, no more death. Tyaktva... After leaving this body, you don't accept any more material body. And if you don't accept material body, then there is no death. As soon as your spiritual, you remain in spiritual body, there is no death. There is no birth also. Death is concomitant where birth is there. If the death is stopped, then there is no birth. And if there is no birth, there is no disease, there is no old age. This is the process. So birth, death, old age, disease can be stopped only by Krsna consciousness. So if you don't like to be Krsna conscious then what is the use of becoming your disciple, and if the guru, if he cannot stop your death, birth and death, then what is your becoming guru? ............ Therefore we forbid to take to the karmi's life. Because at the time of death, if he remains a karmi, then he'll have to take birth as a karmi. That is the risk. So this regulated life, holding class, chanting, that will not make us fall down. That is essential. It is essential, regulate, to follow the regulative principles, chanting sixteen rounds, holding class. You can do anything, but this will keep us alive to the Krsna consciousness platform. If you neglect that, then that is very risky. Even if you get next life birth in a rich man's family, that is not guarantee. Because generally, rich man's sons, they go astray. They get money for nothing and they want to squander it. And material world, if you have got money, so many bad associates will come and help you to squander your money and spoil your life. Because you have got money, then so many friends will come. As soon as you have no money, nobody will come. Even your wife, children will not come. Therefore harisye tad dhanam sanaih. Krsna, first of all, takes away the money, makes him poor so that everyone will neglect him, and because he's Krsna conscious, he'll take Krsna, "Sir, I have no other alternative. Please give me protection." That is also another Krsna's policy, special favor, that "This man wanted Me. Now he's going astray. All right. That's all right. Take everything of his..."

[S.P. Room Conversation, November 3, 1973, New Delhi]